liquin

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Daryl6 wrote
on 21 May 2009 9:37 PM

if you use liquin to glaze, can you use straight oil paint over liquin?

 

 

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christenmu wrote
on 3 Jun 2009 8:13 AM

Hi Daryl,

Did anyone answer your question? I am about to post a question for long term effect of liquin usage in the paintings and saw your question.

I used liquin recently on my studies and I did use oil paints directly on top of liquin and that seems to work fine. But I am not sure whether the paint will stay from years to come. That is my concern. For the time being it works fine for me in my studies since it dries up fast.

My oil postings in portraits forum are all used with liquin. Hope this helps.

Muriel

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on 4 Jun 2009 3:22 PM

Perhaps the manufacturer can answer this question or maybe on their website, they have FAQ's for Liquin. I've put oil paint over dried liquin too, so far nothing's happened.

 

www.loriwords.com

 

 

 

 

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sdoherty wrote
on 23 Jun 2009 11:54 AM

Daryl,

I use Liquin and Galkyd frequently when painting outdoors because the paintings will dry faster and will therefore be easier to pack for transport back home. Most of the conservators I have talked to recommend painting the initial layers of a picture with oils that are thinned with an alkyd medium because the colors will dry quickly and will therefore create less problem as additional layers of oil color are applied.

I am not an expert, however, so I went to the Winsor & Newton website and found the following pieces of information about Liquin. Perhaps this will help in understanding the alkyd medium.

"Traditional oil based mediums are made from a combination of oil and solvents, while the alkyd based mediums combine synthetic alkyd resins and solvents. Because alkyd resin functions in much the same way as linseed oil, alkyd mediums may be added to conventional oils. Alkyd resin mediums offer dramatic advantages by accelerating the speed of drying, as well as adding a unique, natural translucency.

Adding Liquin will make colour/a layer fatter. Adding solvent will make colour/a layer leaner.  Therefore only the lower layers should contain solvent and the upper layers should contain increasing amounts of Liquin.  Because Liquin is a medium and not a solvent there is no upper limit to its ratio with oil colour, however it is recommended that at high proportions the layers are applied as finely as possible.

Liquin will seal the surface of the painting and prevent the drying of underlying paint layers. This is similar to Artists' Painting Medium or Conserv-Art varnishes. All produce a continuous film which excludes oxygen and delays the drying process - hence the recommendation to wait at least six months before varnishing. It is therefore advisable to use one of the Winsor & Newton specifically formulated varnishes." 

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judyl40 wrote
on 23 Jun 2009 1:50 PM

Everyone has their own preferences for this, but I'm with Clinton here. I find that a lot of mediums like Liquin or Galkyd feel tacky to me. So far, what works best for me is just turps & linseed... starting with more turps & making it "fatter" with more oil as the painting progresses.  Then wait 6 months or so, & use a good quality varnish.

I trust Virgil Elliott. Here's his essay on mediums: http://virgilelliott.com/essays.php

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on 25 Jun 2009 11:49 AM

I used to use Liquin, but now tend towards using Gamblin's Walnut/Alkyd medium - it dries like liquin, but acts more like a runny medium - great for glazing. The best part about it is it has no odor.

When working outdoors, I like to use Liquin that comes in a tube - less messy, and no cleanup.

 

www.loriwords.com

 

 

 

 

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Hopie wrote
on 6 Jul 2009 1:47 PM

I am wildly allergic to Liquin although I loved it for itself.  Does anyone else with this difficultly know if Gamblin's medium is better for them?  I  hate to buy a bottle of something I find I cannot use.  I love Sporny Solutions'  brush cleaner, but don't like their painting mediums because I have to mix it well on my palette, something I didn't have to do with Liquin.  I miss Liquin:  cannot bring one I've painted outdoors inside to dry - nor carry it home in my car, so it is out for me.

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on 6 Jul 2009 5:32 PM

I have a sensitvity to the odor of Liquin as well. The Gamblin Walnut Alkyd medium has no odor - just smells and looks like oil. I've noticed that the Liquin impasto that comes in a tube has very little odor too.

I use the tube Liquin for painting outdoors coz it is clean and easy to transport.

 

www.loriwords.com

 

 

 

 

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sdoherty wrote
on 7 Jul 2009 12:07 PM

Hopie,

I contacted Scott at Gamblin and asked about Galkyd. Here is the information he provided:

Galkyd is made from alkyd resin. Alkyd resin, first manufactured in the early 1930's, is produced by a reaction of natural oil with a poly-functional alcohol and poly-basic acid. As a binder, alkyd resin cannot hold as high a pigment load as linseed oil.  However, alkyd has been formulated very successfully as an oil painting medium. Alkyd resin painting mediums are popular because they are made with milder solvents and really do speed the drying time of oil colors. Thin layers of oil colors mixed with alkyd resin painting medium will dry in 24 hours.  The alkyds make very tough yet flexible paint films, these qualities will be imparted into your paint layers. 

 

Alkyd mediums have a great compatibility with the linseed oil binder in the paint.  By adding a small amount of linseed oil and/or Gamsol OMS to Galkyd, this will reduce the medium’s cohesion, and reduce the “tacky” quality.  Our Galkyd Slow Dry is formulated with this in mind. 

 

Liquin and our Galkyd mediums are all based on alkyd resin, but they have very different chemical compositions.  Galkyd has a lower level of solvent and less driers.  Our method of gelling the mediums keeps them clear and jewel-like rather than cloudy like Liquin is.

 

Gamblin has never tried to copy Liquin exactly. Neo Megilp is similar to Liquin's texture, Galkyd is similar to Liquin's dry time. Galkyd Lite is close in dry time also, but it is a low viscosity medium so it affects paint very differently. The gloss level of Galkyd Lite is probably the closest to Liquin.

 

Take a look on our web site for the Interactive Painting Medium Selection Guide that will let you choose the qualities you are looking for and receive a recommendation of which medium might be best suited for your needs.

 

http://www.gamblincolors.com/mediums/interactive.guide.html

 

It will ask you to consider the viscosity of your medium in addition to dry time.  This viscosity determines how the paint flows off your brush.

 

You may also want to consider is the level of solvent in your studio life you are willing to accept.  Our mediums are formulated with and work with the mildest form of solvent (Gamsol, a cosmetic grade odorless mineral spirit is one of these types of solvents).  Liquin requires a mineral spirit, not an odorless mineral spirit.

 

Many artists do use alkyd mediums as a final coat.  Painters should keep in mind that alkyd mediums create permanent paint films.  In this regard, these coats are permanent glazes, rather than a varnish, which is removable for cleaning purposes.  Alkyd mediums do have color, and as with all oil materials the color will increase if the paintings are stored in the dark.  Fortunately, the paintings will recover their color when brought out into light for a few weeks.

 

Our recommendation is to use an excellent contemporary varnish rather than use a painting medium as a varnish.   Our wonderful water clear varnish, Gamvar, is the best way to finish an oil panting.

 

 

Thanks,

Scott

 

Scott Gellatly | Product Manager | Gamblin Artists Colors Co. | 503.235.1945 x12 direct | 971.275.4717 mobile | www.gamblincolors.com


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on 10 Jul 2009 6:36 AM

I didn't reply to this last post right away because I wanted people to see your answer Steve before it got overwritten with my name on the forum heading, but I want to thank you for taking the time and trouble to contact Scott and get such a useful answer.

This is one I'll print out and refer back to. It's worth sharing with my friends as well. Hey wait, I'll just send them over to this forum!

www.loriwords.com

 

 

 

 

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Daryl6 wrote
on 24 Nov 2010 1:01 PM

I believe that answers my initial question. Thank you for all the responses.

Review:

Paint Fat over lean = Fat is more oil in the oil paint, like adding Liquin or other mediums. Lean is diminishing the oil by adding solvents like turpentine.

So you start with lean (oil paint  and turp washes) building up to Fatter ( Liquin and oil paint glazes).

How can I add thick impasto paint over the liquin glazes. I would prefer not to add mediums and use just straight oil paint if I can. Is this possible? Is straight oil paint fat enough?

 

 

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peter_ahart wrote
on 25 Nov 2010 10:55 AM

I had the same kind of questions, which I asked my painting prof. For Liquin you can glaze then paint over it opaquely as long as you are sticking with liquin only. Another way you could do it is paint with luiqin or liquin fine detail and add some linseed oil as you progress in your paintings. That way you are using a fatter paint as the painting progresses. Right now I am experimenting with neo meglip and linseed/stand oil glazes.

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peter_ahart wrote
on 25 Nov 2010 1:50 PM

I emailed Gamblin about it already. They said the problem was when you use natural resin with alkid resins, like darmar and meglip. It seemed like it would not be problematic if the natuarl oils were used sparingly, as long as the fat over lean was used.

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judyl40 wrote
on 26 Nov 2010 9:26 AM

I would keep in mind that any manufacturer would quite naturally promote their own product over any other available product.. Which is why I prefer to go to the AMIEN site (Art Materials Information and Education Network: amien.org) with any questions involving materials & techniques, as they have nothing to sell but information.

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Margo5 wrote
on 26 Nov 2010 11:22 AM

Judyl, this is nice information to have on the AMIEN site. Thanks for posting it.

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